Another technique to break past "no"s when girls give them. And not just break past them… but make it seem like you're the one who gave the "no"!Otherwise known as 'no busters'.
What do you do when you ask a girl to do something and she gives a firm 'no'?
Well, you can just give up and move on completely. And sometimes that's the right call.
What's the best way to pick up girls? Is it tactic A or tactic B? Is Method M superior to Methods S and C? Here's the true exposé on what works best and why.Wanna know one thing that will definitely never help you do better with girls?
Boasting about how your way to get girls is better than other guys' ways to get girls.
There was an old mASF discussion, back in '04 or '05, where the tired old, "What works better, indirect or direct?" debate got dredged up from the crypt and infused with new life.
I recall reading it in the archives.
Two of the participants were Style (Neil Strauss), the guy who wrote the best seller pick up artist book The Game, and Dimitri (Sebastian Drake), founder of the pick up artist training company theApproach, and a guy who served in a mentor role for me for many years.
Style's point was that you could not ever pick up a girl who was an "8 or better" with direct game. You could only use indirect for this.
Dimitri's point was that he had the most luck picking up girls who were "8s or better" with direct game.
I've never rolled with Style, but I spent a fair bit of time rolling with Dimitri, and I watched him pick up some of the most beautiful women I've witnessed any guy I've rolled with pick up, in the single fastest pickups I've seen guys I've rolled with pull off. A stunning young French stewardess he same-day laid off the beach right after we'd swum the Mediterranean (turned out we'd accidentally switched hotel keys, so he shagged her in my room and used my condoms. I had to call the cleaning service after, my room was so destroyed...). A pair of beautiful, flashy, and shapely Japanese girls we picked up off the street outside an L.A. club. Many others. All with direct openers.
I was a pure indirect guy at the beginning (more because I lacked the balls to go direct then, than that I didn't know how to do it). Dimitri urged me to try direct, so I did. And I found it worked very well for me.
I also found it worked better in some situations than in others. Some of the most beautiful, incredible girls I've been with I picked up I picked up with direct. Others of them I picked up with indirect.
I say all this to preface this post, which is not about direct vs. indirect, but instead something else: getting into stupid debates where you tell other guys that stuff they do that is working for them DOESN'T work is stupid.
Ask a girl to do something, and she'll think about it. Sometimes she decides for you; sometimes not. Yet if she's about to decide "not", you MAY be able to intercept that…In sales, you learn early on to make a proposal, then shut up and let the prospect decide.
"Whoever talks first loses," is the way my old boss and sales trainer taught me.
Well... talks first once you've proposed something and the prospect's deliberating, that is.
However, there's one exception to this rule, and that exception is this: when you can tell the prospect is talking himself out of it.
This is a bit of a nuanced thing to catch.
Therefore, this article is really only intended for intermediate and up students of the game. It'll be most useful for men who are already at least somewhat advanced with women, and will be able to attune to the signals we'll talk about here a lot more easily.
If you're a beginner, you can ignore this article for now and hew to "whoever talks first loses (after you've made a proposal)", and it'll server you well the majority of the time.
But if you're farther along than 'beginner', it's time to take a more nuanced view.
Many men today believe women's standards are too high. The reality is, women's standards have ALWAYS been high… or at least, women have always claimed this.Again and again of late I've seen this argument that women's dating standards are simply too high.
That women expect too much of men, they want men who are perfect, and their standards are completely unrealistic.
Most recently, a reader commented this on my article about the source of 21st Century Western men's distinct lack of action and motivation, saying:
I dont think men dont have the drive to have sex; its just that womens standards are too high and most men dont make the cut. Most men are trying and failing to get laid, others have given up, and a small percentage is getting almost everything. We have to be realistic and acknowledge that most men are going to be average no matter what. The problem is that women have too many options and society allows them to go for the top men.
This is a common refrain from a lot of men's sites on the web.
“How's any guy supposed to have a shot in this day and age?”But is it true?
Are you, indeed, condemned to suffer loneliness and deprivation, sucking up the scraps of women who fell off the tables of ALPHA MALES, those rare few men who get all the girls?
Is this simply your lot in life, assuming you're unable or unwilling to join the ranks of those few elite men?
You want to date someone long-term. But is she sexually compatible? Most people don't check… yet this is perhaps the #1 most important compatibility of all.I spoke recently with an experienced seducer who was having some issues with a girlfriend of his. The relationship had begun normally, with the girl having a normal sex drive, but then at one point it changed.
After the change, his woman almost never wanted normal sex with him. This was well-traveled girl who'd experimented sexually with all kinds of men and had a history of stopping having sex with prior boyfriends of hers.
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The seducer would notice flashes of desire come across his woman in inconvenient and novel situations (like say a crowded dinner with friends in the heart of downtown). She'd suddenly want some spontaneous, inconvenient sex.
He'd instead try to get her somewhere private. But a 20-minute drive to privacy later and her sex drive would be gone, never to wake up again that night, no matter what he did.
This was a guy who's been with many women and never had a problem turning most of his prior girlfriends on before. But with this girl he was in a sexual desert.
There's a problem with incompatible sex drives that most guys do not realize until they find themselves in a sex drive incompatibility scenario.
Often even when they're IN that scenario, they refuse to see it.
They tell themselves they can fix it.
That they must be doing something wrong themselves.
The fact is we tend to assume that others' sexual reactions to us are a result of us.
When in actuality a whole lot of the way someone reacts is in large part directed by that person's underlying sex drive.
And sex drives are a thing you really cannot change.
You can't train them. You can't 'wake them up' long-term (yes, there is sexual awakening. But it tends to be fleeting; the sex drive spike it brings last maybe 5-10 years).
You can only enjoy drives if they're compatible... or gnash your teeth endlessly if they're not.
There are these stupid, clueless, needy questions men ask women. Perhaps you've asked some yourself. Yet these questions are pure sabotage for your seductions.This is really more for new guys than anyone else.
Though I have still sometimes seen intermediate guys making these mistakes too.
In school, you probably learned "There are no stupid questions."
Well, that might be true in school. However, in dating, it is not. Because when it comes to women, there are absolutely a lot of very stupid questions that you should not ask.
We're not talking about questions like "How old are you?" or "How many guys have you been with?" that various stern women claim men should "never ask a lady!" or that "don't matter!" on various feminist-leaning blogs or news sites around the web. Those questions are actually perfectly fine; I suggest you ask both regularly (the second works better after sex, though).
However, there exists a certain class of question that, when you ask from it, conveys a degree of neediness, uncertainty, and lack of leadership that repels women like oil does water.
These questions are the ones we can, for our purposes, safely dub stupid questions.
Sometimes you make a move on a girl and she hits you with "let's just be friends." Yet just because you got one LJBF doesn't mean you're out of the running…You make a move on a girl or ask her out.
She looks you firm in the eyes, aaaaand... "I thought we could just be friends!" she tells you.
Just like that, the wind has sucked all the way out of your sails.
I guess you have to just be friends with her now.
...
...
...
I'm kidding. What point is there to that?
You're talking to her because you want her. Either to date her or to have a fun roll in the hay with her.
When she puts the "let's just be friends" (LJBF) frame on you, you're faced with several options... but not all these options are created equal.
You should not talk about game with most people. It might be tempting to (especially when it's a major point of interest of yours)… but mum's the word.This is a sort of public service announcement, mostly for new guys, but really also for any guy who gets a little 'game obsessed' and starts to spout off about game and girls.
In your day-to-day life, you will have ample opportunity to talk about women.
I suggest that, unless you are on a seduction forum or with a group of men whom you know are very much into game, you don't mention it.
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That can be trying at times, especially when seduction is your passion.
However, you really are better off not doing it.
The simple fact is that discussing the art of picking up girls is alienating to 99.97831% of men out there, including many other men who like to pick up girls.
We talk about it here on this site, and if you read here often it might feel like a normal conversation subject, even. Nevertheless, for most people, this is a subject they do not ever talk about, and don't feel comfortable talking about.
So you need some rules around discussing it.
The best rule is, "For most people, don't discuss this subject at all."
A sound corollary to that best rule is, "For those you do discuss it with, tread lightly."
Are you tuned out while out? If you notice a beautiful woman, is it a surprise you were unprepared for? Here's how to tune IN (in 5 simple steps).In my article on scouting for 'meet girls' spots, a reader named Kevin comments
Hey Chase,
From the articles such as this one where you talk about your observations of other people when you're out on the street, I'm always struck by how aware and tuned-in you are to other people. Myself, for various reasons, I got into the habit of being totally in my head and tuned-out whenever I'm out on the street; I'm also very eye-contact averse, with everybody. I don't look, or I break off immediately. The only exception to those would be when I take very long walks or do day game sessions. And since those feel so much better because I'm really tuned-in, this ability to really absorb your environment and be totally present in it is one I very much want to automate. My question is about your eye-contact. Do you shamelessly observe everybody around you, holding eye-contact with anyone who gives it to you? Do you use the overhead eye-contact tactic from the 'Elite EC' article where you only look at people who look at you? Could you please give me some tips on how to emulate your own tuned-inness to the people around you when out on the streets? Somehow, probably because of social control, I'm really shy about just looking at people and observing them shamelessly!
Many thanks in advance,
Kev
It's a good topic for discussion. Attunement can be a fleeting thing. It's also by no means assured just because, for instance, you went out to approach women.
I observed in that article that the vast majority of people you pass by in life are tuned out. They're lost in their thoughts, thinking about what they need to do that day, absorbed in messages or notifications on their phones -- their heads are anywhere but present.
The attuned man enjoys some distinctive benefits. One is that women notice him much more. Attuned people are in it; they gaze around, their eyes are wider, they're noticeably taking in their environment. Attuned people look for other attuned people, and a woman who's attuned will tend to very quickly notice an attuned man (and you'll notice her). Which women are most likely to be attuned? Those who have a reason to pay attention. Much of the time this means women who are looking to meet someone.
Attuned men are also more risk-aware and better able to present as hard targets to avoid dangerous situations. Very useful if you live in dangerous places (or venture into them from time to time).
There's only one challenge: how do you tune yourself in?
Because for most people, being tuned in is merely a thing that happens to them, on rare occasions, when the mood strikes, or when they chance into the right state.
But that doesn't have to be the case for you.
You can attune yourself directly and consciously, if you know how.
You can use phone calls (yes, phone calls!) to reward women for good behavior – like good vibes and happy dates… but don't call when she's been naughty…Phone calls are totally old school and no one ever uses them anymore. Right?
Well, the truth is men have always avoided phone calls as much as and wherever possible.
Back when texting wasn't all that popular and no one had messenger apps on his phone, guys still didn't like to make phone calls. They're nerve-wracking, higher pressure, and you can't sit and think about what you want to say -- it's all happening in real time.
Yet men who learned to use them then discovered phone calls were an almost magical way to bolster good connections with girls, repair frayed ones, and get out onto dates women who wouldn't otherwise have come.
And believe it or not, in the age of furious thumbs tapping out multitudinous messages, they still do.
On the forums, guys have repeatedly noted they tried calling girls (despite thinking it was out-of-date) and were amazed how well it went. Young women whom nobody ever calls, ever, get calls from guys and the calls go great and they lead to dates and hookups.
But this article isn't about whether to use phone calls or not use phone calls.
Instead, it's for that elite subset of men among you who already use them.
And the focus here is on how to reward with phone calls... or punish with their lack.
